Nebelhorn Mens competition quad report

Gold medalitst Tatsuki Machida of Japan performed a quad toe loop in his free skate. The base value was 10.30 and with positive GOE it was worth 10.87.

Silver medalist Konstantin Menshov of Russia performed a quad toe+single toe in his short program which had a base value of 10.70 but with negative GOE of 3 points was worth 7.70 points. I assume all that negative GOE comes from doing a single jump. In the free skate he did a quad toe loop +double toe loop that had a 11.70 base value but with positive GOE of 1.43 was worth 13.13 points.

Bronze medalist Peter Liebers of Germany and fourth place finisher Armin Mahbanoozadeh of the US tried to do quad toes in their free skates but tripled them.

Michal Brezina of the Czech Republic who was the frontrunner to win had trouble with the debut his quad salchow which was doubled in both the short and long programs. Everyone says in practice it is great but maybe nerves got to him.

Sui/Han Chinese pair at Cup of Austria (Jr GP event)

At the Cup of Austria -a part of the Junior Grand Prix season World Junior Champs Wenjing Sui and Comg Han of China coached by Luon Bo (former partner of coach Yao Bin) won silver after their free skate included a throw quad salchow and an attempted quadruple twist. They got negative GOE on the throw quad salchow (because she two footed the landing) but the twist attempt was downgraded.

The throw quad was great aside froom the landing. She obviously got in four rotation and the look of the jump was exactly how it should look in my view.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucvWQvuqLRA

You see Kavaguit and Smirnov of Russia try it all the time but it rarely looks as good as when Sui/Han did it today!

Sui did seem too low to get a full quad twist in.

The Gold Medal winners Stilbova and Klimov have great unison and it is not surprising at all that they won but I think if Sui and Han hadn't both fallen (I guessed Sui looked like she slipped more than fell on a jump) they would have won.

Keegan Messing tries quad toe loop at JR GP event

At the Junior Grand prix in Romania Alaska native Keegan Messing tried a quadruple toe loop in his free skate September 1oth. He fell and it was downgraded. Instead of getting a < for underrotation he got a << which means it was totally downgraded. I did not think I would see a quad attempt at a GP event because usually a triple axel is the ceiling of jump difficulty. So that Messing tried is admirable. Good for him! He won the first Gold for US skaters on the junior grand prix circuit.

The base value was 10.2 but he got only 2 points for the attempt and because of the fall deduction it was really only 1 point for this quad attempt. That hardly seems like enough to do such a big move.

http://www.adn.com/2010/09/11/1450115/messing-claims-first-at-romanian.html

Patrick Chan does quad at liberty

For the first time ever in a competition (even if it wasn't an official ISU competition and basically doesn't count) Patrick Chan did a quad. He did a quad toe loop with positive GOE in his short program at the Liberty competition in Pennsylvania July 16, 2010. This is a big move for him. He wants a quad to add to his almost always level 4 spins and steps and great choreography, interpreatio-basically the PCS marks.

Chan got into fights with Joubert and non-directly with Plushenko I guess-when he said just doing the quad should not matter in winning- a skater needs EVERYTHING-well everything includes the quad and if he added that successfully to ISU competitions than everybody better look out-especially world champion Takahashi.

After he did the quad he fell on his triple axel. This is common when people do quads-they tend to fall on their next jump and that is why you don't see them much in short programs. But practice is the way to get this sorted out.

Last year he was injured and thus couldn't compete really until Skate Canada where he placed sixth. He had to skip Cup of Russia where he would have competed against Plushenko-who did two quads-one in his short and one in his long program. He would then go on to Canadian nationals and then the Olympics and then worlds-all without a quad and having trouble with his triple axel, He won Canadian Nationals, stumbled at the Olympics and then won the World silver. All of this while doing shaky triples but of course getting HUGE HUGE PCS marks.

He should definitely not go the route of doing quads while just doing double axels. When I think of the quad I think of someone who can do all the triples and then progresses to the Quad. The 1998, 2002, 2006 Olympic champions all had quads and triple axels.

He should keep going for it ALL.

http://web.icenetwork.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100717&content_id=12330910&vkey=ice_news

ISU adds second quad option to mens short program

This is odd as very few to almost no skaters do one quad in their short programs. I don't believe this was because skaters didn't like that they couldn't do two! LOL. The past three world championships and the Olympics has shown that no one who does a quad will win a competition based upon how judges are scoring programs right now. Now I do know that the ISU has removed a required step sequence from mens skating. That would give a man who wanted to do a quad or two more set up time. I thought the main reason why quads have nearly completely vanished from mens short programs was because of the time required for set up. There are so few skaters who do quads anymore and you can see that are routinely criticized for lacking choreo and tranistions in there programs as they need time for set up and also recovery really. You might have read what Plushenko was reported to have said in an interivew when he commented on not having transitions because he focuses on his jumps.

Now if you look at Kevin Reynolds who has the talent for a quad toe and quad salchow-would he do both in his short programs? Maybe he will do a test and see what will happen to his PCS score as a result of doing two quads. I thought Brian Joubert could do both a quad toe and quad Salchow but he really hasn't done a quad salchow in a while - and also what would happen to his PCS? Takahashi can't do a quad toe anymore so he tried a quad flip but failed (but failed better than his failures with his quad toe) but he probably wont try anything but a flip now.

Overall it seems to be an odd change as quads are largely disappearing from mens skating anyway.

ISU Meeting

The ISU meeting this week should have something on the quad jump. I mean for 10 years all the world and Olympic gold medalists did it and now of course winners no longer do it. Jumping has gone horribly backward and I hope something is done to get it back on track.

2009/2010 season

Staring with the Trophee Eric Bompard when Nobunari Oda won beating Tomas Verner it was a sign of things to come. For the 2009/2010 season Oda had a program that differed from his previous seasons in that he removed the quads. Why would someone do this for the Olympic season? Because he wanted to win and the world championships the previous March showed that with Lysacek and Chan winning Gold and Silver quads were on the way out. The system as a whole punished them severely. They just weren't worth doing with spins steps and PCS and the inherent risk of doing them in the first place. Tomas Verner started his implosion in the free skate. While Oda with his no quads was able to beat Verner and win the Gold there. In third place was Adam Rippon - an almost total COP skater who never even thinks about doing quads because doing lots of jumps after the halfway point are worth more than quads when you really add everything up.

Trophee Eric Bompard-Winner no quad/-silver medalist quad/-bronze no quad/

Rostelecom Cup- winner with quad/-silver medalist no quad/-bronze no quad

Cup of China-winner no quad/-silver medalist no quad-/bronze-with quad

NHK Trophy- winner with quad/silver with no quad/bronze no quad

Skate America-winner no quad/silver no quad/bronze with quad

Skate Canada- winner with quad/silver no quad/bronze no quad

Grand Prix Final- Winner - no quad/silver no quad/bronze no quad

Olympic Games-Winner no quad/silver quad/bronze no quad

World championships - winner No quad/silver no quad/bronze quad

19 medal performances without quads
8 medal performances with quads

COP is spelling out the death of quads

The following aren't worldwide so I don't tend to count them but I will mention them.
Euros-all medalists did quads
Four Continents-winner no quad

If you look at the breakout star of the season I believe it was obviously Michal Brezina. He is almost a purely COP skater. Everyone says he is the best jumper with a great quad. I have heard it from Paul Wylie, Scott Hamilson, Peter Carruthers and more. He did not even try one once. Why? Because he is smart and knows COP rewards jumps after the haflway point more than quads in many ways. Higher PCS being one way.